Reynel
Posts: 50
Joined: Thu Nov 05, 2020 8:39 pm
Occupation: Student

Re: Help! Procedure in Making SAP Using Orange and Avocado.

Postby Reynel » Thu Feb 25, 2021 7:36 pm

Hi Mr. Sybee,

Sorry, my reply was posted after your reply. It was supposed to be before.
I forgot to tell you but we put a mosquito net above the containers yesterday. We will be posting the pictures of our set-up later. We are also preparing for our testing methods but we are trying to focus on our modules for now. We will be updating you everyday of our plans of how our experiment goes.
For now, the peels are looking good. they have no molds except for the one small container with Orange and Avocado peels. This might be because the container is small and there were a lot of peels there. Because of this, the peels were not spread enough and didn't dry well compared to others. Other than that, there's no problem about the other peels. The others are looking good and are well dried.
That's it for now.

Thank you Mr. Sybee,
Reynel

Reynel
Posts: 50
Joined: Thu Nov 05, 2020 8:39 pm
Occupation: Student

Re: Help! Procedure in Making SAP Using Orange and Avocado.

Postby Reynel » Fri Feb 26, 2021 6:54 pm

Hi Mr. Sybee,

Another Update, today will be the last day of our sun drying process. We started last February 23, so that'll be 5 days in total.
I am updating you everyday even though you haven't responded yet. So, there might be messages you still haven't read. You can check the past 3 messages we've sent.
We are also starting to build our greenhouse. We will be putting our plants in a pot and our greenhouse will be built on a table. So we will be putting the pots on a table and we will cover it with a plastic cover.
Will that be okay?
I'll be updating you later about how did the peels turn out, but for now only one container have molds just like what I've said in the past messages.
Thank you so much Mr. Sybee, I hope you are doing well there.
I am glad that there is progress in your situation there and you'll be having your vaccines. Here, there's no news yet about when will we be having our vaccines. Most of the people don't want to have the vaccine so its ginna be a bit hard here.
I hope it all goes well,
Reynel

SciB
Expert
Posts: 2044
Joined: Fri Feb 01, 2013 7:00 am
Occupation: Retired molecular biologist, university researcher and teacher

Re: Help! Procedure in Making SAP Using Orange and Avocado.

Postby SciB » Sat Feb 27, 2021 5:03 pm

Hi Reynel,

I'm glad to hear that your peels are finally sun dried with less mold than before. I hope the rest of the procedure goes according to plan. A greenhouse is a good idea to protect your plants but make sure it does not get too warm inside. What plants are you going to grow? Many crops need 8-10 hours of direct sun per day to grow well and this could cause your plants under the plastic to get too hot.

Upload some photos of your set-up so I can see how you are doing things, since I can't be there in person.

We got our first shots yesterday and no problem--just a little soreness in the muscle where the injection was made. The second one is in three weeks and then we'll be protected--at least for a while. Why are people in your area hesitating to get the vaccine? Are they afraid it will harm them? There's no proof of that and it would have shown up by now with all the thousands of people who have been vaccinated.

Stay safe,

Sybee

Reynel
Posts: 50
Joined: Thu Nov 05, 2020 8:39 pm
Occupation: Student

Re: Help! Procedure in Making SAP Using Orange and Avocado.

Postby Reynel » Sat Feb 27, 2021 7:04 pm

Hi Mr. Sybee,

Update on our Experiment: Today is the day we will be oven drrying, blending and testing our SAP. We are currently oven drying the peels in 130 degree celsius for about 20 minutes.
About the plant, we will be growing either Lettuce (Pechay) which grows like this: https://www.google.com/search?q=pechay+ ... K4p-iw2flM
or Okra known in many English-speaking countries as ladies' fingers or ochro that looks like this: https://www.google.com/search?q=okra+pl ... NJacNNmN7M

Can I ask Mr. Sybee what plant do you prefer for us to grow? We will be measuring both the height and the number of leaves.
If we're going to use the Okra, we can also check the number of flowers, but it may take a bit longer than the Pechay.
While if we use Pechay, there might be a lesser difference between the plants with SAP and no SAP in terms of height and number of leaves.

About our greenhouse, we will be putting it on a table and make a frame as a cover for it using a plastic cover.
It will looke a bit like this but it will be placed on top of the table so that we don't need to make it bigger and it will be easier for us to test every 7 days since we can just remove the frame.
https://br.pinterest.com/pin/359232507757878653/

Do we need to put it outside in a direct sunlight or we can put it in our terrace where its sunny but not directly hit by the sun?

We will be making the set up for our testing methods today, we will be sending the picture of it later in the evening. Its 10:00am here in the Philippines as of now.

I'm glad that you have your first shots already. people are a bit hesitant here since the media have been reporting news about different complications that had happen in other countries that are "rumored" to be caused after getting a vaccine. But, it hasn't been proven by Science but people will really believe what they hear and see because of the media. I can't even blame the citizens especially those that are poor since they don't have access to right informations that they should know before getting a vaccine. I hope the government could educate the people and assure them before giving them vaccines just so everyone knows what it is for.
We are also a bit hesitant since we don't know where country are we getting the vaccine from, they are trying to give us vaccine from countries with lower efficacy rate and that scared the people even more.
I'm glad you get yours and will be getting the next one. I hope, by then, you can be a little bit more free than you were when there's no vaccine yet.

Stay safe there Mr. Sybee and I hope it all goes well,
Reynel

SciB
Expert
Posts: 2044
Joined: Fri Feb 01, 2013 7:00 am
Occupation: Retired molecular biologist, university researcher and teacher

Re: Help! Procedure in Making SAP Using Orange and Avocado.

Postby SciB » Sun Feb 28, 2021 9:20 am

Hi Reynel,

Nice to get the news from your part of the world. I am sorry for the people who are afraid of getting the vaccine because they don't trust it. It is good to be careful, but unfortunate when it is something like a vaccine that could save your life. There are people in the U.S. who are not going to take the vaccine because of reports that are not based on scientific evidence, but I believe that enough people will get vaccinated that it will get the disease under control, even for those who are not immunized. If they get COVID and survive, then they will have some natural immunity, but they could have avoided that pain by simply getting the shot.

I am glad that you think about your experiments and plan them well ahead of time that is the sign of a good scientist. I would vote for okra as the best plant to show the benefits of SAP. I have grown it in my garden and I know it grows fast in warm weather and gets pretty tall, so should make it easy to assess growth by measuring height. It would be nice to be able to count the number of flowers and pods made, but you don't have to do that. The 'greenhouse' looks good, but make sure it is large enough for your plants and that it does not get too hot inside. What is the temperature in the daytime and at night? Here it is well below freezing at night (-15C) so we start plants indoors under grow-lights and on heating mats and don't put them outside until the end of May when the soil has warmed up.

Okra is a sun-loving plant, so if you can possibly grow it in direct sun it will be best. Does your terrace face the south? If you can get filtered sun it would be ok. It just needs to be direct from sun to plant for best photosynthesis. If you put the plants outside, there is a risk of animals or people bothering them, so maybe you should keep them inside. Remember that you should have at least three plants for each treatment so you can average the growth results and do a statistical test on the means. Also, be careful what kind of soil you use. Are you planning on using soil that you dig up outside or buy from the store? Purchasing potting mix is a good idea, but you have to read the ingredient list because many of the commercial mixes contain fertilizer and water-holding amendments that could mask the effects of the SAP.

Good luck and stay safe,

Sybee

Reynel
Posts: 50
Joined: Thu Nov 05, 2020 8:39 pm
Occupation: Student

Re: Help! Procedure in Making SAP Using Orange and Avocado.

Postby Reynel » Sun Feb 28, 2021 8:04 pm

Hi Mr. Sybee,

Thank you so much for helping us! We planted Pechay yesterday (in the afternoon) since we haven't got a reply from you yet and we're unsure if Okra can grow within 30 days. We also don't have enough SAP since we have 21 samples for testing the Average Plant Growth alone.

Here are the problems that we have encountered yesterday:
1. Since we divided the peels into two, that will serve as Powder and the Mixture, the Mixture batch was oven-dried for 40 minutes in 130 degree Celsius when it's normally 20-25 minutes. This is because we have too much strained liquid (260ml) and lesser peels (175 grams) since it was divided into two.

2. We weren't able to test the Water absorption capacity of the SAP and the Water retention of the soil this is because we don't have enough SAP that we made and because our Salinity meter chose not to work that particular day.

3. We are supposed to plant 21 samples yesterday.
Trial 1:
Sample 1 10 grams of LAP Powder
Sample 2 20 grams of LAP Powder
Sample 3 30 grams of LAP Powder
Sample 4 10 grams of LAM Mixture
Sample 5 20 grams of LAM Mixture
Sample 6 30 grams of LAM Mixture
Sample 7 NO SAP
Repeated for Trials 2 and 3.

But we were only able to conduct 16 samples.
Trials 1,2,3 for both LAP Powder and LAM Mixture with 20 grams are all conducted.
Only Trials 1 and 2 were conducted for 40 grams of LAP Powder.
Trials 1,2,3 for LAM Mixture with 40 grams
Trial 1 for both LAP Powder and LAM Mixture with 60 grams
and Trial 1,2,3 for No added SAP.
Which are 16 samples out of 21.

4. Another problem is that the pots that we have are those that have holes at the bottom of them. I am contemplating whether this would affect them since the water may pass through it. But, we don't know any market that sells those with no holes since it is supposed to have holes.

Our greenhouse is big and high enough. We will also be putting it in our terrace where there's sunlight but not really directly hit.
Do you think we should change our plant to Okra or should we just stick to Pechay?
Do you think there will be problems with pots that have holes under them or its okay like that?

Also, we used the soil from our backyard. We tested its soil moisture from 1-10 (1 being the most dry and 10 being the most wet) and it says 2.
The temperature here in our town lately is about 3035 degree celsius. Its quite hot here but not too cold in the evening.
We will be conducting another batch of SAP for other experiments when we have found Avocados and other resources.

I am still scared because we haven't tested our powders yet if it works or not.
The experiment yesterday didn't go as smooth as I thought it would be. There were a lot of problems that we've encountered. Do you think these would really affect our Results? Do you think the Plants can grow for 30 days without water since we only gave it 50ml of rainwater?
I have a lot of worries and questions and I am scared that this might not be successful.
I hope you can help us Mr. Sybee,
Reynel

SciB
Expert
Posts: 2044
Joined: Fri Feb 01, 2013 7:00 am
Occupation: Retired molecular biologist, university researcher and teacher

Re: Help! Procedure in Making SAP Using Orange and Avocado.

Postby SciB » Mon Mar 01, 2021 6:40 am

Hi Reynel,

Experiments always work in the sense that they give you results. The results may not be what you want, but they always tell you something if you can interpret them correctly.

The pechay will work fine. I only suggested okra because it grows tall rather than wide as lettuce. When you measure the growth, you should measure the width of the lettuce plant as well as the height.

Pots with drainage holes are always used for growing plants as water pooling in the bottom could cause the roots to rot.

I would suggest doing a simple test of your backyard soil to determine the ratio of sand to clay and loam. Here's a video that shows how to do this, and there are others: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AUhOBxVFcFk

Don't worry about not doing the salinity and water absorption tests. A farmer wants to see the results in improved growth of crop plants so that is what is most important. Other details are useful to scientists who study the mechanism of soil improvement to make it better. So, get the pechay seeded and growing as soon as possible. I'm not sure if 50 ml is enough water, however. It depends on the volume of soil. It needs to be evenly moist throughout or the seedling's roots won't grow properly. If some runs out the bottom, that's ok, as that is what happens in nature on sandy, porous soil. The idea behind adding organic matter such as compost to sandy soil is that it acts like a sponge and keeps the water from running through and taking nutrients with it.

Good luck,

Sybee

SciB
Expert
Posts: 2044
Joined: Fri Feb 01, 2013 7:00 am
Occupation: Retired molecular biologist, university researcher and teacher

Re: Help! Procedure in Making SAP Using Orange and Avocado.

Postby SciB » Mon Mar 08, 2021 7:55 am

Hi Reynel,

It has been a week since I heard from you last and before you were posting every day. What's going on? Send me an update on your experiments and your next batch of questions.

I'm here to help as best I can, so talk to me!

Sybee

Reynel
Posts: 50
Joined: Thu Nov 05, 2020 8:39 pm
Occupation: Student

Re: Help! Procedure in Making SAP Using Orange and Avocado.

Postby Reynel » Sun Apr 04, 2021 7:41 pm

Hi Mr. Sybee,

It's been so long since we've last talked. There have been many changes in our study and we never got the chance to update you about it. These past few months have been hectic for us because of other academic activities other than Research. We are having a hard time balancing both our academics and this project. That's about it for us, how about you? How have you been there?

Our last experiment didn't go quite well. It was also a failure since the Powder didn't do its work. Our Pechay Plant is now 26 days and we haven't had the chance to Re-plant it on its15th day because ur powder didn't go well. We will be trying again another experiment for Orange and Avocado.

We listed down the variables that may have been affecting our study such as:
1. Usage of non-organic fruits instead of Organic
Solution: We will be using Organic Avocados harvested from our backyard. While we will still try to find Organic Oranges and Lemon for the lemon juice since those don't grow well here in the Philippines.
2. The amount of time to boil the Orange peels
Question: Does the amount of time boiling the peels needed to be exact? And the liquid strained after boiling, does it really need to be 250ml just like Ms. Lakshita's?
3. The exact time of Sun-drying
Question: Since there is no exact time provided for the SUn-drying process, we assumed that we will just Sun-dry the peels until they are fully dry which is about 7-10 days. This might change since the season now in the Philipines is Summer already. Will the amount of time for Sun-drying affect the result of our study?
4. The amount of liquid the peels can absorb when oven-dried
Question: Do we need to add all the strained liquid from the oranges to the peels that are needed to be oven-dried? We noticed that when we add 250ml of strained liquid to the peels for 25 minutes at 180 degrees celsius, the peels couldn't fully absorb the strained liquid which results in a slightly wet peel when powderize. But, if we try to add a time of oven-drying the peels get burnt which results in a black powder. Which one will we sacrifice, a burnt powder or not adding all the amount of strained liquid to the peels being oven-dried?

This is the list of all our queries for now. We still have a lot in mind but we are trying to tackle it one at a time. We are still figuring out why our study won't go as planned. We are thinking that if this last experiment won't go well, the only choice that we have is to use the powder as fertilizers and change our whole study.

I hope you are doing good there Mr. Sybee!

Sincerely,
Reynel

SciB
Expert
Posts: 2044
Joined: Fri Feb 01, 2013 7:00 am
Occupation: Retired molecular biologist, university researcher and teacher

Re: Help! Procedure in Making SAP Using Orange and Avocado.

Postby SciB » Thu Apr 15, 2021 9:30 am

Hi Reynel,

I was thinking that you would never talk to us again. Next time take two minutes for a quick message.

I wish i had 100% correct answers for all your questions but science does involve a lot of trials that don't always work, and knowing what to change is one of the challenges.

I don't think organic vs non-organic would make much difference, but using fresh fruits may give better results. Lucky you to have an avocado tree in your backyard!

The boiling time is important, but does not have to be 'exact', just long enough. And, yes, I would keep the proportions of liquid and solids the same as Lakshita used.

Making sure the peels are dry thoroughly but not moldy is the goal of sun-drying, so it will have to be adjusted depending on your conditions. Longer is ok as long as mold doesn't grow on them or some small animal doesn't carry them off.

How long do you let the peels sit in the liquid before drying in the oven? You might want to lower the temp to 110C and let it go longer. Of course, if you burn the peels they are not going to work, so just reduce the temp.

OK. That's all I can think of to help you. As I said before, simply converting the fruit waste into compost and adding that to the soil as an amendment will increase the soil's water-holding capacity and decrease the amount of irrigation water needed to grow a crop, as well as providing some nutrients to stimulate plant growth. Making a polymer is a great idea, but if it is this hard to do, then simple composting makes more sense.

Keep us posted on what's happening with the project.

Sybee

Reynel
Posts: 50
Joined: Thu Nov 05, 2020 8:39 pm
Occupation: Student

Re: Help! Procedure in Making SAP Using Orange and Avocado.

Postby Reynel » Thu Apr 15, 2021 9:30 pm

Hi Mr. Sybee,

I'm sorry it took too long for us to respond from our last reply. We will make sure to still update you in the future even when things get a little bit hectic. Thank you for still helping us.

We conducted an experiment last April 13, using orange and avocado peels. But, the peels that we used from the orange, is relatively thinner than the peels Ms. Lakshita and Ms. Nirghin used it is because its from a different kind of orange. We will be sun-drying it for 5-7 days depending on when it will be fully dried. We also planted last April 5, a new batch of Pechay Plant, and on its 15th day, April 20, we will be re-planting them in soil with the SAP Powder.

That's our only plans for now, we don't have anything to really plan about in our work since everything still depends on the result of our Powder--- whether it works or not.

If we have forgotten a thing or two in our study or we have some things to change or improve, I hope you can point it out for us.

We don't really get much guidance from our Research Teacher because he handles so many students and he has a lot of workload so we try to understand him as much as we can. But this is also why we don't know much if we're doing the right thing and if we're on the right track. I hope you can suggest any improvements in our study, it will be much appreciated.

Thank you, Mr. Sybee! I hope you are doing well there. Covid-19 cases here in our country has been on its peak ever since the Pandemic started. The situation is getting worse and worse than it has ever been. I hope you are safe there! We will get through this.

Sincerely,
Reynel


Return to “Grades 9-12: Life, Earth, and Social Sciences”