Science Buddies: "Ask an Expert"

I'm doing a project in which I need to extract the chemicals that are in make-up so I can test their reactions on different proteins. I've found several methods of extraction, but I don't know if any of them will work. I really want to persue this topic so any help would be very greatly apreciated!!

Sounds like you picked an interesting area of investigation.
What grade are you in? Have you had any chemistry yet?

I'm doing a project in which I need to extract the chemicals that are in make-up so I can test their reactions on different proteins.

How about sharing your hypothesis? Knowing specifically what you want to test may provide a clue to a simpler way of doing the testing.

Cosmetic formulations tend to have LOTS of different things in them to do lots of different things and their formulations are closely gaurded secrets. Chemical extraction from complex and unknown formulations is an extremely difficult task, often much more difficult than qualitative and quantitative chemical analysis to determine the composition. Why climb this mountain if you can obtain the ingredients you want to test in other ways?

What does decomposing a formulation into its components really do for your testing if the consumer uses the product as is? For example, if the formulation contains some pH buffer to control a potential chemical reaction of another ingredient, then testing without the pH buffer may alter the test results and invalidate your ability to infer something about the original formulation.

im in 10th grade and I'm taking honors chem right now.
Do you think it would be posible to obtain some of the chemicals that are said to be in there so that I could test them directly?

I'm in 10th grade taking honors chem right now.
I havent really developed a hypothsis yet because I'm still trying to determine if I really can carry this out

[quote="Craig_Bridge"]qualitative and quantitative chemical analysis to determine the composition.
Do you know how I would be able to do that?; what will that show exactly?

thanks soo much!

qualitative and quantitative chemical analysis to determine the composition.
Do you know how I would be able to do that?; what will that show exactly?

Chemists have developed various methods for determining if a chemical exists in a mixture and to determine how much of it exists. This is typically introduced in a second semester college chemistry lab. The first part is qualitative (does a chemical exist) and the second part is quantitative (how much of the chemical exists) in a mixture. Doing even this isn't easy without expensive spectrometry equipment if you don't know all of the potential chemicals. In other words, the introductory labs tend to give you a known limited set of possible chemicals which greatly simplifies the process.

The point I was trying to make was that it is far more difficult to extract a chemical from a mixture than to determine if it is present and/or how much of it is present. During analysis, you are free to alter the chemical to look for or measure a reaction product. For extraction, you need to preserve the chemical and separate it out without contaminating it with other chemicals. Complex extractions are typically doctorate/post doctorate kind of work.

Obtaining pure compounds and testing them is definitely much easier as long as you can obtain the compounds. Without knowing what you want to test, we can't help you with finding the materials and advising on the safety and expense of working with those chemicals.

Earlier you mentioned testing how various cosmetics affect different protiens and I mentioned pH buffering. Can you elaborate on which protiens? The stability of protiens is strongly influenced by pH.

these are some of the chemicals I read that can be harmful in make up
•Bentonite
•Ethylene glycol
•GLYCERIN

do you know if we would be able to obtain these and how expensive they would be?
there are also other chemicals i read about but didnt write down so if these are hard to use there are others i can test

eilish wrote:these are some of the chemicals I read that can be harmful in make up
•Bentonite
•Ethylene glycol
•GLYCERIN

do you know if we would be able to obtain these and how expensive they would be?
there are also other chemicals i read about but didnt write down so if these are hard to use there are others i can test

Where are you getting information that these compounds are harmful?

Bentonite is a form of clay. It is also used as cat litter, and maybe could be purchased in a pet store. If it is used in comestics, it is probably ground up more finely. I doubt this is toxic, breathing the dust may be bad, but so is breathing the dust in a sugar factory.

Ethylene glycol is antifreeze and is toxic, but I would be very surprised if it were in cosmetics. Other glycols are not toxic and would be used instead.

Glycerin is widely used in food, medicine and makeup. I'm not sure why you would think this is harmful. I imagine it is relatively cheap to buy. People who make their own soap might use it, so I'd try a craft store.

What exactly are you testing? I suggest you look at the science fair guide:
https://www.sciencebuddies.org/mentorin ... ndex.shtml

You should develop a hypothesis based on your research and then determine an experimental method to test your hypothesis. It seems like you are doing this backwards... you are listing chemicals with out any apparently experimental plan or hypothesis.

I'd like to repeat what Craig said. Proteins are very pH sensitive. Makeup has a lot of ingredients (generally) to assure that the over all product has a certain pH. If you test one ingredient A, and find it denatures protein it doesn't mean all makeup with ingredient A is bad. Instead, the company probably adds compound B, which counteracts the pH effect of A. You need to think very carefully about what you want to test, and whether this is relevant to the real life situation you want to model.

Louise

http://www.cosmeticsdatabase.com/index.php?nothanks=1

this is the address of the website i've been using to try to see what chemicals that are harmful are said to be in make-up
i'm not sure if what i posted before from that web site or another source

my teacher just wants me to be sure that i will be able to test this before i go on with the project

do you know anything more about these
placenta extracts
mercury
lead
phthalates
hydroquinone

i know that mercuy and lead are very toxic and that the placenta regulates hormones in woman reproductive system. i dont really know much about the other things.

eilish wrote:do you know anything more about these
placenta extracts
mercury
lead
phthalates
hydroquinone

i know that mercuy and lead are very toxic and that the placenta regulates hormones in woman reproductive system. i dont really know much about the other things.

I suggest you go to the library and look up these items. [I provided some information about your first list, but I'm not going to do your research for you] Why don't you actually look at some labels instead of this website you posted? You've now posted two lists, both of which contain many items that would not be found in makeup. Also, if you want to give us a website to show us something, you need to give us a specific link. I'm not going to click through 45 categories of makeup trying to find where they said lead is found in makeup.

I still have no idea what "test this" is. Until you tell us what your hypothesis is, and what you are specifically trying to test, we cannot help.

Louise