Artifical Photosynthesis

[irregular]

Hello,

It's been a while since I've been on the Science Buddies forums. Ms. Donna Hardy helped me throughout my last year's science project.

This year, I'm interested in pursuing artificial photosynthesis. Before I choose my question for my project, I'd like to find out if it is possible to be done without a lab, and not at the nano-scale. If not, I may possible have to switch my idea.

Here are some articles about artificial photosynthesis:
http://www.scientificamerican.com/artic ... g-the-leaf
http://pubs.acs.org/doi/abs/10.1021/ar900209b
http://newscenter.lbl.gov/news-releases ... synthesis/
http://www.wisegeek.com/what-is-artific ... thesis.htm
http://gcep.stanford.edu/research/facts ... photo.html
http://science.howstuffworks.com/enviro ... thesis.htm
http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/05/arti ... -if-its-n/
http://depts.washington.edu/chemcrs/bul ... olar.2.pdf
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/20 ... 103646.htm
http://spectrum.ieee.org/nanoclast/semi ... echnology-

Thanks,
Irregular

EDIT:
If this isn't possible, some other science projects I will consider include:
https://www.sciencebuddies.org/science- ... p025.shtml
https://www.sciencebuddies.org/science- ... p066.shtml
http://pubs.acs.org/doi/abs/10.1021/es901950j

[nithintumma]

Hello,
Artificial photosynthesis sounds like an amazing project, the technology has the potential to revolutionize the energy industry and reduce our dependence on fossil fuels. However, from the links that you provided, it seems that the bulk of research is focused on bioengineering molecules that are able to capture and store the energy in light waves. They seem to model the biological system found in plants that utilize electron transport chains to transfer energy from the light wave into a biologically useful form. However, I do not think that this type of bioengineering project is possible without access to a scientific lab and a mentor who has experience in this field. Sorry, but perhaps there is another facet of photosynthesis that you would like to explore, perhaps measuring its efficiency to determine how efficient artificial photosynthesis would be in harnessing the sun's energy. You could compare it to the efficiency of various solar panels to determine which form of reusable energy can harness the sun's energy more productively.

Good Luck with your project,
Nithin T

[barretttomlinson]

Hi,

This is the best approach to artificial photosynthesis of which I am aware:

http://newscenter.lbl.gov/press-release ... synthesis/

http://www.lbl.gov/Science-Articles/Arc ... -fuel.html

http://pbd.lbl.gov/PBD_web_site/web_sit ... /frei.html

http://www.citris-uc.org/files/Frei%20DK%20visit.pdf

If you are seriously interested in this approach, in your shoes I would get a copy of the Frei and Jiao paper in Angewante Chemie, study it, and see how easy it looks to replicate. I suspect you would need access to a college level research lab and a friendly professor mentor to get very far. Since this research is just a year or two old it may be difficult to get access to a lab equipt to replicate it, but you can certainly try. Otherwise I am unable to suggest a project to meet your criteria.

Good luck!

Barrett L Tomlinson

[irregular]

Hello,

Thank you so much for your input and advice, I really appreciate it. However unfortunately I will not be able to gain access to a lab or specialized mentor.

If you do have any other possible project ideas for me, please do respond. I will search for other possible ideas, and if am unsuccessful will settle on the Microbial Desalination Cell project (http://pubs.acs.org/doi/abs/10.1021/es901950j), as a continuation of last year's project (where I constructed a Microbial Fuel Cell). I am hoping to finalize my idea by the end of this month.

Thank you.

EDIT: I am looking for creative, original, interesting subjects in environmental science/biology. I enjoy reading articles on the Scientific American website. Hopefully I will be able to use my resources creatively (school science supply, dad's engineering plant,etc) for the project, since this year it won't be possible to have a specialized mentor or access a lab.

[adance]

Hi irregular,

I'm sorry the artificial photosynthesis won't work out, but I hope you'll still be able to find a project that interests you. Some questions you could ponder:

What interested you about artificial photosynthesis? Is there some small piece of that problem you could tackle in a less technologically-advanced project?

You mentioned an interest in environmental science. What problems or questions do you see out in your environment? I imagine there are a lot of questions you could ask about pollution or how different species interact--questions you could do at a small scale with your home/school equipment, that would still have big implications.

Good luck!

[donnahardy2]

Hi Irregular,

Welcome back to Science Buddies! It sounds like you are expanding your interest in energy related topics and the subject of artificial photosynthesis is a fascinating subject. Everyone else who has posted is right about the complexity of a project, but I'm sure there must be something you could do related to the topic.

Here is the program for last summer's conference on porphyrins and phthalocyanines. Why don't you read through the titles of the presented papers and do a literature search for more information on anything that sounds interesting to you? Your science fair project could be an investigation on one specific question related to the topic. Please note there were several papers presented on natural chlorophyll

http://www.icpp-spp.org/general/ICPP-6_program.pdf

Here are some science buddies project ideas on fuel cells and solar energy. Read through these for more ideas.

https://www.sciencebuddies.org/science- ... p020.shtml

https://www.sciencebuddies.org/science- ... p002.shtml

https://www.sciencebuddies.org/science- ... p011.shtml

https://www.sciencebuddies.org/science- ... p004.shtml

I’m sure there is a perfect project that you can do with the resources you have available. Please let us know what you are thinking about doing.

Donna Hardy

[donnahardy2]

Hi Irregular,

Here are some abstracts related to your topic, with information on the design of the photochemical cells. It sounds like you would need some titanium, iridium, and platinum and other ingredients to make a photoanode and photocathode to generate current. Definitely challenging.

http://pubs.acs.org/doi/full/10.1021/ja809108y

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_o ... archtype=a

http://pubs.acs.org/doi/abs/10.1021/jp071906v

Let me know if you have any trouble accessing any of these links.

Donna Hardy

[irregular]

Hello,

Ms. Dance: The part I find most interesting about the artificial photosynthesis project is that I can take this one concept (photosynthesis) and transform it into something that will better the world. That was also why I chose last year's project, where the concept was anaerobic respiration and fuel cells.

Ms. Hardy: Thank you very much for the program for the conference you sent me! There are quite a few topics I'm interested in (e.g. electron transfer and biosynthesis of chlorophyll), although they all sound as if a lab will be needed to conduct the experiments.

Thank you very much also for sending me the abstracts! They sound extremely interesting too. They mention nanotubes and nanoparticles, so I was wondering if it would be do-able for me.

Today on the C&EN website, I saw that an article about Dr. Logan's MDCs was just published yesterday!
http://pubs.acs.org/cen/news/88/i48/8848news3.html

Thank you!

[donnahardy2]

Hi Irregular,

Thanks for your reply. I don’t know if you could do a project on nanotubes and nanoparticles. These projects would require lots of resources, but you should continue your background research to find something that you can do.

This first link includes a reference that describes using recycled tires to make nanotubes. The second one uses plastic bags for the application. This type of project would require an expensive catalyst.

http://www.all-science-fair-projects.co ... n_nanotube


http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/disco ... nanotubes/

Here’s a summary of a science fair project that used nanotubes for a medical application. I’m sure this project was done in a lab, but it is a good example of a useful application for these particles.

https://emtsef.utsa.edu/History/Listing ... 14SS10A7B7


Thanks for the link on the new Logan group desalination device. This would be a good project for you to develop as you could use your skills in constructing leak-free devices and growing anaerobic bacteria for this project.

Donna Hardy

[irregular]

Hi Donna,

I find the nanotechnology aspect very interesting, however my biggest concern is where I can obtain nanotechnology (particles, tubes, etc) and how to work with them. If I do use nanotechnology, I'd like to go in the environmental field.

I'd like to do something different this year, but will pursue the desalination idea if I must. If I pursue this idea, I'd like to take full advantage of my resources and use my knowledge on desalination (e.g. reverse osmosis).

I am also interesting in "cellulosic ethanol", however am not sure if it will be a do-able topic. What do you think?

http://science.howstuffworks.com/enviro ... thanol.htm

Thank you!

[donnahardy2]

Hi Irregular,

The desalination project is probably more feasible for you to do. I have not been able to find a practical idea on nanotechnology that could be done outside of a laboratory at a reasonable cost. However please let me know if you have a microscope.

The cellulosic ethanol project is an excellent idea. However, I don’t know if you would be able to get approval to do a project on ethanol; please check with your teacher on this topic.

The desalination project is a good one. I think that your approach to doing science fair projects, which includes doing thorough background research and carefully designing an experiment could make this a winning project. The Logan design is a new development on this field so would be a good place to start. The Science Buddies website has a project on this topic also, which includes good background information.

https://www.sciencebuddies.org/science- ... p022.shtml

Since you are starting early, you will have more time to solve the construction problems that are inherent in this type of project. The practical application of a desalination project is readily apparent. You need to identify something that will make your project unique, for example an improvement in design or improvement in performance.

Why don’t you go ahead and continue your background reading on desalination so you can decide exactly what to do.

Here is a commercial company that you could contact for more information.

http://www.catpumps.com/pumps-desalinat ... awater.asp

Look at this site and let me know if you can understand it. It includes some background information and discussion of problems on developing desalination devices.

http://urila.tripod.com/Seawater.htm

Here is some general information.
‘http://www.reverseosmosisdesalination.com/
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DT4FcyZmmJ4
http://www.lenntech.com/processes/desal ... rocess.htm

Here are some problems involved in desalination:

http://pubs.acs.org/cen/news/88/i41/8841news.html
This website lists a number of problems that you might want to work on:

http://www.oas.org/DSD/publications/Uni ... e/ch20.htm

Here is some fairly recent news on a new development in reverse osmosis technology,

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/20 ... 135931.htm

Do you know if your local water company does any desalination? You can call and find out and ask for more information and someone who you could talk to. You might be able to find a local mentor for the project.

I’m sure you can find more sites. Please let me know what you find out.

Donna Hardy

[irregular]

Hello Donna,

I am exceedingly grateful to you for taking the time to explore and give me those website links.

I checked my local science fair rules, and did not come across anything about ethanol or fuel. However I think that I will pursue the desalination project area. In grade 6, for my local science fair I had actually done the Science Buddies Solar-Power desalination project. I think that it would be great doing a project in this field again.

I will talk to my dad about this project and start my background research now, and find out if any local company does desalination and contact a company perhaps. I'll definitely look out for ways to make my project unique.

Thanks!

[donnahardy2]

Hi Irregular,

I think you have made a good decision in the selection of your science fair project. I know you will learn a lot doing this project. Desalination is a well-established method, so I would recommend trying to identify a problem (power requirement, membrane fouling, etc) and design an experiment to solve the problem. Your background reading should help you decide what needs to be done next in this field and will help you become an expert in the subject.

Do let me know what you find.

Donna Hardy

[irregular]

Hello Donna,

I have obtained quite a few scientific papers and have read them to complete my background research. My father and I contacted two MFC-related researchers, including Professor Logan, for some advice on membranes. We purchased an anion and cation membrane through an online website about a week ago, but they haven't arrived yet. The company gave us both free due to my father's occupation in his company. We also asked my father's friends who are also PhD-holding engineers for some advice and clarifications.

Right now I am not sure which bacteria to use, or where to obtain it from. I tried looking at some national bacterial collections, online science websites, nearby university websites, etc. Would you please help me determine those two out? I am looking at the following bacteria:

http://microbewiki.kenyon.edu/index.php ... urreducens
http://microbewiki.kenyon.edu/index.php ... oneidensis
http://microbewiki.kenyon.edu/index.php ... rireducens
http://microbewiki.kenyon.edu/index.php ... m_septicum
http://microbewiki.kenyon.edu/index.php ... erfringens
http://microbewiki.kenyon.edu/index.php ... ermocellum


Thanks and regards!

[donnahardy2]

Hi Irregular,

You have made some amazing progress since you last posted! Congratulations on finding the source of the membrane that you can use for your project. You will be ready to set up the experiment soon.

The bacteria you found references for are all organisms that can form biofilms and clog membranes. They can probably be purchased from ATCC, or you could growh naturally occurring bacteria. If you used pure cultures, you would need to sterilize your set-up and verify that the organism you selected was growing. This will be challenging since you don't have access to a microbiology laboratory.

Here is some background information on membrane fouling:

http://www.separationprocesses.com/Memb ... hpRO-7.htm

Please let me know what problem you are trying to solve. Are you trying to build a better desalination device, or are you working on a method to prevent membrane fouling? I can suggest a source of bacteria if you can let me know exactly what you want to do.

Donna Hardy